Transcript:
: Hello everybody! This is Meisha Rouser and welcome to my show and thank you for listening. This show is all about professional and leadership development.
Basically, everything you need to know to be competent and confident in your professional life. By listening to this show over time you will gain valuable information on a variety of topics like communication skills, conflict skills, personal productivity, leading without authority, a lot of emotional and social intelligence and so much more.
By listening each week you will acquire unique tools and gain exposure to proven research, tips and of course, a little bit of wisdom sprinkled in, I hope, to help you in your professional development.
What we’re going to be talking about today is how to quickly determine how best to communicate with others. We are going to be talking about personality types. Understanding the different personality types can help you when trying to motivate others and with understanding what is important to them.
There are a variety of personality assessments like Myers-Briggs, DISC and so forth. They are all based on similar information. For example, Myers-Briggs stems from content that Carl Jung had created about personalities.
Carl Jung found that we have a lot of different types of personalities. It was a lot of information but it was some great information. And then the Briggs came along, mother and daughter, and said, “Okay, this is too much information. How can we compile this and make it so that it’s more tangible and meaningful?”
They created the Myers-Briggs assessment and they basically boiled it all down into 16 different personality types, categorized into four sub-groups. Personally, I still think the 16 personality types that they boiled it down to is still too many to try to remember. I found this other model that I really like. This model I find much more applicable as you only have to remember two things in order to make a quick assessment to identify in order to improve your communication with the other person.
By the way, keep in mind, we all have these different personality types for the most part. While some people tend to camp more dominantly in one or two personality types, we all embody all of these types.
One of my pet peeves, me personally, I never enjoyed taking the assessments because I hated being pigeonholed because they would say, “Oh, you know, you are an ENTJ,” or something. I’ll be like, “You know what, I am that sometimes and sometimes I’m not.” For me I found, and I think a lot of people can relate to this, we all show up differently in different circumstances and so we bring in different personalities based on the circumstance.
Ideally, as a human being we want to try to embrace all of those different kinds of personality types to find what works best contextually in the situation. So anyway, I’m not just one for pigeonholing. So as I’m going through this and I’m going through the types of personalities that I’m speaking towards is I will highly recommend try not to pigeonhole yourself. However, it is pretty helpful sometimes to know what you default is though. A lot of times too our strongest defaults will come out in a crises situation. Just to let you know, that’s where you’ll find that’s what’s important to me and how I react.
With that being said then I’m boiling these down then to basically 4 different personality types. There’s a couple of different ways you can think about this. The 4 different types, I like to use the word Focuser, Innovator, Relator, and Operator. Some of you may have heard different names for some of those but basically I just find those to resonate with me more.
If you’re visually, when I’m teaching this in a class, I actually create a matrix. It is just with the 4 boxes. If you imagine in the upper left hand corner is usually where I put the Focuser and then across from it, the upper right hand corner, would be the Innovator. Down below Innovator would be Relator and across from Relator on the Focuser is Operator.
When you look at the matrix – if you’re actually listening to this and you have a piece of paper and you want to write it down – it would be really helpful. Because then if you would then label the top of the matrix Fast and then the bottom of the matrix Slow.
So for example, Focusers and Innovators tend to be faster. They think faster, they move faster, they like to, go, go, go. Whereas, the Operator and the Relator tend to like to slow things down and analyse what’s going on and to assess. So they like to be a little bit slower.
Going back to the matrix we have the top and bottom, if you also go from the left and label those rows as data or task-oriented and then the other side of the matrix, over on the right, more people-oriented.
So for example, the Focuser and the Operator tend to be more data, task-oriented. Over on the other side, the Innovator and the Relator tend to be more people oriented. I’m going to go into more details about all of these but just for those of you who like to visually think about this, that’s what I usually draw out.
I’m going to really quickly explain what each of those are and then what I’m going to do is dive into each one and talk about what motivates that particular personality type or that phase. What motivates them, how to manage them, especially if you’re managing some who is younger. How to manage that personality type, how to communicate with them, what might be their pet peeves. This is going to help you to quickly assess who am I talking to, how are they thinking, how do I need to adjust to them?
Where we’re going to start is highlighting all of them. So Focuser tends to be very fast paced and more data task oriented. They’re the ones who tend to like to get things done quickly. They’re the ones who if somebody drops the ball, they would pick it up, take it and go.
They love to get things done. They go quickly. They don’t want to have people in their way and so forth. Sometimes, those people called Focusers also can be called Drivers. They tend to be the Drivers. In fact, if you were to think of an analogy, sometimes I’ve heard about this being an analogy of a train. You can think of the Focusers as being the ones driving the train.
It’s just like, “You know what? I’m getting to point A to point B. I’m push down the gas, we’re going. And if there’s any cows in the way or whatever, I’ve got a cow scooper that’s going to push them out of my way. We’re going! Don’t get in my way.” So that’s kind of what a Focuser or sometimes called the Driver, that’s their high level personality.
Then on the other side of that, the other personality type that tends to be fast is the Innovator. However, the Innovator also tends to be a little more people oriented. So the Innovator is somebody who is the kind of shiny light. “Oh, look at the pretty light over there. Now its over there,” or the squirrel analogy.
They’re the ones that are usually very optimistic, positive. They’re enthusiastic. Sometimes they’re called the Cheerleaders a little bit. They just have a great view on life. But the reason I like to call them Innovators is they tend to also think so outside of the box. They have all kind of ideas. Sometimes they’re all over the place, and a little bit maybe, sometimes people relate to them like they have their heads in the skies.
It’s like, okay you’re not being realistic.
The Integrator, they’re the ones that come up with great ideas. They keep people going. They’re kind of that spark sometimes.
Below them, still with the people-oriented side, is the Relator. So the Relator though likes to usually slow things down a bit. They like to take their time and assess things. They like to see, okay how is everybody else doing?
They’re the ones that usually, if you’re a Focuser you tend not to be people oriented. So a lot of times the Focuser will ask the Relators, “Hey, what’s going on with Jane today?” and the Relators totally know. Relators get other people. They’re very sensitive and tuned in to other people. They’re usually really good listeners.
The last one is the Operator. So the Operator is then also slow. They like to analyse, but they like analyse from the data side of things, the task side of things. When I think about them, they’re the ones that kind of stop and say, “Okay, you know what, the world would be totally chaotic if we didn’t have systems and procedures in place.” They like to make sure that are we being safe, did we think things through, are we being smart?
They like to slow down and say, “Okay, what’s going on? Where’s the train? How can we slow down and how can we put some systems, procedures?” So that’s kind of the idea of an Operator.
Going back also to the train analogy, if that helps it all, so the Focusers tend to be the ones driving the train. They’re just, “Go, get out of my way.”
If you think especially the evolution of trains and the person who in the past used to be shovelling the coal and putting it in the train to get the train to go, that role could probably be the Integrator. It’s like, “You know what, this coal thing is not working. What if we did steam? What if we did…” all of these other ideas. How could we get to where we’re going and take care of everybody, but what are some other ideas and some other ways of doing it? So that could be the Innovator role.
The Operator role is going to be more of what’s called the train conductor. Their role is actually to make sure, okay is the train functioning together, where is the train going, how many box cars are going to be on the train and so forth. So the Operator is looking at how’s the train is going to get to where it’s going.
Then, the Relators usually a lot of people like think of as the conductor, is the ticket taker. The person inside who makes sure everybody is happy, where’s the bar cart. So that’s another way to kind of think of all these.
And again, we need all of them. All of these personality types, we embrace all of them. We need all of them because they help counter and balance each other and that’s what creates us as being unique human beings.
How are we doing on that? Because I know it was a lot. Benny, you’re kind of …
Benny: I’m ready to jump on board.
Meisha: Woohoo! Jump on board, the train whistle. What I’m going to do is to take a quick break and then we’re going to come back and dive into more deeply about how do you communicate and work with these different personality types and what are those traits.
COMMERCIAL BREAK
Welcome back to the Meisha Rouser show. We are talking about leadership and professional development. Today we’re going to talk about personality types and how to quickly try to assess, quickly be able to assess other people’s personalities so when you’re trying to talk with them, influence them, motivate them, on the fly you can figure this out.
The first part of the show we went over what are the 4 different personalities that I’m going to be talking about. Now, I’m going to dive deeper into each one of those. Where we left off then is we had highlighted everything. Now I’m going to talk about each one individually. We’re going to start with the Focuser.
Sometimes a Focuser could be called a Driver. Sometimes how people will describe them is the cowboy. They tend to like to work independently, do their own things, go explore new frontiers, just don’t get in my way. Benny, you’re laughing.
Benny: I’m definitely not a cowboy. I can be at times just because of my position and what I do. But, again, what you’re saying about the whole 16 other Myers-Briggs, yeah, those apply to some people but not all the time though. So this is a much better description – the 4 that you’ve come up with.
Meisha: See, I’m the kind of person that likes to keep things simple.
Benny: For a lot of people too, not just us.
Meisha: 16 things to try to remember, it ain’t happening. You’ve got to give me something simple.
Benny: Depending on where you are, your personality may shine brighter or not as bright or differently, in just some areas. With this, it seems a little more like the boarders have been kind of reduced and relaxed a little more.
Meisha: What I like about it too then because you’re only thinking about 4, then you can also assess instantly yourself in a situation and say, okay what do I need, who do I need to be right now? Maybe what’s called for is I need to be more of a Focuser or more of a Integrator. Or maybe I need to be more of an Operator or maybe more of a Relator.
It helps to kind of see what’s going on and what balance needs to happen. In fact, it was so cool, I was recently with one of my clients that I’m on retainer for. I had gone over this with his managers a couple years ago and he is telling me they still use this. “I use this every day.” He claims that he’s very much a Focuser, “I claim it. I know I am. I tried to be the Relator but that’s why I hired a president who is a Relator.” It’s so true. It can really help to know who we are and why we show up the way we do, and how we can manage this.
And, remember the Focusers to not like to be micro managed.
Usually, Focusers will tend to fall into positions like sales. Great at sales, just give me a quota, I’m going go nail that quota. Don’t bother micro managing me. A lot of the salesforce, when you think about that, they’re Focusers.
A couple of other things about them is remember regarding how to identify them, they’re fast. “Don’t slow me down.” And, they are data and task oriented. Because of that then when you communicate with them you need to give them the facts but don’t give them more details than they need. They don’t care. They’re not going to be listening. Then, because they are so fast and more task oriented, when you are emailing them, when you’re talking with them, you’re probably not going to be communicating with them using a lot of emotional words. In fact, that’s one of the things that a lot of people will say about drivers, “Well, they just don’t care.”
For example, I was hired to help two executives were butting heads. The first time I’m talking to one of them, the first thing she’s explaining to me is, “You know, he has no idea the names of my kids. We have been working together for three years and he still can’t remember the names of my kids.”
When I ended up talking to the other executive, he’s a Focuser. He really does care about those things but it doesn’t hold. He doesn’t remember the name of her kids. In the meantime, she’s a Relator and he’s hurting her feelings by not remembering those details. Whereas, if you talk about data and specific tasks and so forth, he is all over that.
This is one of the bad reputations that erupts that Focusers will sometimes get, is that people think they’re insensitive, and that is so not the case. With them, they believe there’s a time and place for everything. This goes a little bit with the Operator too. Those people who are more data and task-oriented, there is a time and place for everything.
When we are at work, we work. I don’t need to know about your dog and the football game and stuff like that. Now, it doesn’t mean I’m not open to that. It’s like, yeah if we go out at lunch, I want to know those things. When we are having a break or whatever that’s great, but when we’re at work we are at work.
Speaking of that, if you ever did accidentally step on the toes of a Focuser, the best way to address that is to sincerely just acknowledge it. To say as quickly as possible, “I’m sorry I did that blah, blah, blah, are we cool?” A lot of times they are, “Yeah, we’re cool,” and it’s done. Just leave it alone and then just go on.
So let me highlight in here a couple of things that I want to make sure that we’re nailing. One, communicating with them, get to the point Two, what motivates them is achievement. It’s all about getting it done so that’s why they love sales. They love getting things done and it’s all about the achievement.
For example, when you look at their cubicles or in their offices, if they have anything on their walls it might be like a flow chart or a progress board and so forth. Or, it will may be what some people say is their brag wall. Yeah, maybe their certificates and that type of thing. Now, to be honest a lot of times the brag wall isn’t necessarily for your benefit by the way. What I mean is, it’s not for everybody else, it’s for them. It motivates them. “I did that. I achieved that.” They may have a picture of them on the top of the mountain or them holding the big fish. It’s all about achievement. It motivates them.
What motivates them then is again achievement. So when you’re trying to sell them on something, you’re talking quickly, you’re giving them the data and you’re telling them what they can achieve. “You know, John if you were able to help us on this project I bet our team would be able to finish first in front of everybody else’s team.” Or, “John if you’re willing to help with this project it would probably really help you be seen better by the higher management and I know how you’re wanting to get a promotion.” Sometimes spin it in a way that they can see how they can achieve something, how they can strive towards something. And, again, when managing them do not micro manage them.
Here’s one thing then, when we are managing younger Focusers is that sometimes they tend to leave a wake of destruction behind them. They don’t see the damage that they’re doing by stepping on other people’s toes just because they are more data-task oriented.
In that case, sometimes you do need a help them start to develop some empathy. Help them see how maybe they’re not playing as fairly in the sandbox.
Remember when they were kids we tended to lean towards one or more of these personality types. We have learned over time how to soften up and become more well-rouned. If you were a Focuser and you were literally playing in the sandbox with other kids and just taking the trucks because you wanted it, somebody was probably saying, “You know, we need to think about other people.”
So we’ve been working on integrating all of these personality types. But if you are still managing a Focuser, that’s one thing you may want to think about; to help them understand and be more sensitive to other people.
Now I want to go over to the opposite side of the Focuser, to the bottom right corner – if you’re looking at your matrix – is the Relator. I tend to like to go across because usually one of the pet peeves of the Focusers are the Relators and the pet peeves of the Relators are the Focusers.
So let’s go over to the Relator then. The Relator tends to like to slow things down a little bit. They like to assess things and they’re very sensitive to what’s going on in the environment and with other people.
A lot of times the Focusers will rely on the Relators and say, “Hey what’s going on with Sally?” And then the Relators will say, “Yeah, Sally, she’s blah, blah, blah that’s what’s going on.” I use this because I’m kind of a Focuser-Innovator myself and that’s why I’d always ask. Then the next question would be now that I understand what’s going on with Sally, it’s like, “So what do I do?” and the Relator could tell you. “Oh, you should probably just back off. Give her some space.” I’ll go, “Okay, great I’ll do that.”
The Relators is all about the people. What motivates them is the harmony in the workplace. I mean to them it’s like, “Oh my gosh, if we could create a harmonious workplace, that is so exciting.” So when you are trying to motivate them or trying to get them to do something you want, spin it in that way. Just say, “Sally, would you be willing to help me out with this project? Because we think by having you involved, we probably will be able to help get more synergy within the group and bring in more harmony.” Oh, they would probably be all over that.
If they are more people-oriented then when you’re talking to them you may want to be bringing in more of those emotional words, feelings and what does it mean to others and so forth. And, they also want you to take the time to connect with them.
With that being said, Relators are also tend to be really good listeners. Because of that, then, usually everybody in the organization, at least around them, tend to go to talk to them because they’re such good listeners, they understand and they’re empathetic.
If you are managing a Relator that can be one of the struggles that they’re having. One of the things that I hear a lot is if somebody is complaining they don’t have enough time to get their work done. One of the questions I’ll ask them is try to figure out their personality type, because if they tend to be a Realtor, it’s because a lot of their time is being taken up talking with other people. And I don’t mean that in negative sense. It’s just sometimes it’s really helpful for the team for them to be there.
Part of when you’re managing them, especially if they’re younger, is to help them learn how to create boundaries. For those of you who might think that, “Oh, you know what, probably my more dominant might be a Relator,” and if you’re a little more mature you have probably learned how to create boundaries around how to say “no”, how to say, “You know, I really can’t talk to you right now but I would love to be able to talk to you at this later time.”
Being able to create those boundaries and if you’re managing a younger Relator sometimes just helping them do that can be really helpful. A lot of times I will talk to my Relators, even the ones that I’m coaching, and if that’s one of their issues, I’ll go in to their office. “Okay, that chair right there that you have across your desk, which and by the way, all the candies that you have in your desk, you’re just inviting people in. So take the chair out. Take the candies out. Move the desk around so you’re not facing the door so that people can’t see you and just don’t pop in.”
Now, when I first suggest that to Relators usually it makes their skin crawl. “Oh, but that would be so mean. I wouldn’t want to do that. That’s just so rude.” No, it’s not. It’s just, again, creating an environment where you can actually get some work done and then you can always choose then when you want to socialize and talk with other people.
Remember I was telling you about that executive who was really hurt that this other executive that she works with doesn’t even remember the names of her kids? Relators want to know that you care, and so usually I find when talking with them, is to start out not by just asking what you need. If you’re an Operator or a Focuser, start out a little softer. “Hey, how are you? Hope things are going well for you.”
A great example I had one time when I was working, this was quite a few years ago, and I was in my office and I had to print something out. My assistant was out by the copy machine and I could tell that the printer had run out of paper. I was being too lazy to go out and change it. So I sent her a quick email and just ask her, “Can you change the paper in the copy machine?” Then after a few minutes or so I hadn’t gone out and got what I had printed out and so she had brought it back in to me. When she brings it in, she puts it down on my desk and she’s just looking at me and asks, “Are you upset with me?” And I said, “Huh? Why? What?” She replies, “Well, you just sounded like you were mad at me. Because your email seemed a little curt.” I was like, “I was just asking you to change the paper.” I realized it sounded like I was mad and so I learned. I now always start with, “I hope you’re doing good today.” So we’ve got to think about those things.
With the Relator we need to be sensitive with them and just slow down. If you are a Focuser or an Operator, slow down a little bit and just acknowledge the human element.
One other thing about with the Realtor is if you think about their offices and what they have on their walls, they probably have a lot of pictures of family and pets and those type of things. So that’s also how you can quickly tell who you’re communicating with even if you don’t know them is by looking at what’s on their walls and what do they have up there. Is it more data-oriented achievement or is it more people-oriented?
One last tip on them too is that if you accidentally step on their toes, usually for Relators, unlike the Focuser, it’s not just quickly apologizing but it’s also understanding too that this is going to take more time. They don’t just let things go. They will take so many things personally. In fact, that’s a really good point to remember that those people, the Innovators and Relators, that are more people-oriented tend to take things personally. So we need to take more time when you step on their toes to rebuild that trust.
COMMERCIAL BREAK
Welcome back to the Meisha Rouser show and we are live here in Seattle and talking about the different personality types. I do want to really quickly cover the other two, the Integrator and the Operator.
It won’t take me long and that’s one of the reasons I like to explain the Focuser and the Relator first because they also hold similar characteristics in regards to being either fast or data/task driven or either being slow and more people driven.
Because one thing you really want to remember here is that rarely, rarely, in fact I’ll probably say never do we just sit solely in one of these personality types. What we tend to do is we flow around. For example, I’m more a Focuser/Innovator so I’m almost always fast. I tend to be up on that top row. However, I can also move from data/task over to people pretty seamlessly. And so we always kind of move around a little bit on this.
Let’s talk real quickly though the last two and then we’re going to take the call. So, the Innovator is also fast paced and also more people-oriented. They love to get things done but they want to know why. Why am I doing this? Especially in regards to who is it going to help, because they’re Relators, they’re concerned about other people.
They love to help other people. They love to have ideas on how to help other people. “Oh, let me help you here. I have this idea of what we could do differently or what you could do differently.” And so the big thing then with Innovators is they are more team oriented and they have a ton of ideas. They’re the ones that are coming up with enthusiasm and excitement. What we really need to watch with them, especially for managing younger Innovators, is sometimes they will see something that’s, “Oh my! This is something so cool that we can create.”
They see things that other people don’t see. When they’re moving through a project they so want to create this amazing thing, when sometimes we just got to move forward. We’re not going to have time to create this amazing whatever it is, and that can really be a bummer for them. They’re like, “No, no, no, one, just one more thing, one more tweak.” They would almost rather get it “right”, seeing the potential of what can be or so engrossed in what they’re building, versus hitting a deadline.
If you’re an Innovator you’ve probably learned over time how to just say, “You know what, it’s good enough,” and move on. As a manager you got to do that very gently, too, for other innovators you manage. So just say, “You know what John, what you’re creating there is really fabulous and I know you have some great ideas and it would be great if we could code that in. Right now though we don’t have time for that so we’re going to have to move on. Maybe later we can come back to your ideas.”
Here’s why I’m pointing this out, because it’s really important with Innovator to know that they are either on or they’re off. If you bash their ideas or don’t listen to them, they will turn off and getting them to turn back on takes a lot of time. So, in other words, you don’t want to say, “You know what John, we just don’t have time. We’re not going to do it.” Or, “John, no, we can’t do that. No, just do what I want you to do.” That will not keep them engaged.
Whereas, it best not to just say no. Instead say, “You know what John, that’s a great idea. I like it. I just don’t see how we can implement it right now or maybe we could do that in another phase,” or whatever. So just really watch that you don’t slam their ideas.
What motivates them then is why are we doing this. They are more people-oriented and they like to be Innovative and creative. So, what motivates them sometimes, is doing things for other. “You know, wouldn’t this be great for the team? What would you like to do for a team picnic? What would you think would be a great idea?” They’d be like, “Yeah, I’d be happy to help come up with ideas about the team picnic.”
Now, finally, the Operators. Usually the pet peeves of the Innovators are the Operators. “They’re such a buzz killer,” “So boring.” They want to take forever to just analyse things, right? Whereas, the Operators are thinking, “Oh, please your head is in the sky. Let’s come back to reality.”
Operators are the glue at times. They really help ground everybody else. So when the Focuser grabs the ball and starts running, the Focuser could be running towards a cliff, and it’s not until the Operators points out, “Excuse me, I think there’s a cliff up there.” That the Focuser says, “Oh yeah, right. Sorry, where do I go now?” (Operator) “You want to go that way.” (Focuser) “Okay, thanks.”
So the Operators helps to keep order and keep everything and everyone safe. So when we think about what motivates the Operator, it is how we’re going to do things and how we are going to be safe about it. Safety is a big thing for them. Here’s the thing that sometimes people say, that Operators aren’t willing to change the rules. That’s not the case. They are willing to break the rules or change the rules, they just want to analyse things first to make sure we are being smart about this. What could be some unintended consequences, have we looked at everything and then if everything looks cool, “Alright, yeah, we’re good.”
Operators, when we’re communicating with them, we want to get them the data they need or are asking for: no more, no less. They don’t want just random data. They want the applicable facts, give them data that pertains to what they are asking about.
What motivates them is to help them figure out, okay, how can I do this in an effective and efficient way? When you step on their toes, they’re also kind of the same as Focusers, being more of data or task oriented. So, just acknowledge it, address it upfront, apologize. “I’m sorry, are we cool?” “We’re cool.” “Great.” Then just move on.
Okay, I think I got most of what I was wanting to share. We can always come back to these in another show. But let’s go to our caller. Michael, thank you very much for holding on the line.
Benny: Yeah, Michael from Bremerton, welcome to the show.
Michael: Thank you, Meisha. I have two questions. My first question is, what is your recommendation as to the most practical personality type indicator test? So for example, if you are a first level supervisor. Maybe you’re newly promoted and you want to understand the different personalities in your department, what would you say is the most practical?
The second question is, I’m wondering if you can comment on the differences between introverts and extroverts. Given the kind of graph that you presented and where they generally fall?
Meisha: Awesome. Great questions, Michael.
Okay, so let’s do first the personality type indicator. You know, that’s a hard one, to be honest. As I have stated up in the beginning of the show, I have my own personal disclaimer. I personally don’t like personality tests. I don’t like being pigeonholed. I mean, one of my pet peeves is when I go into an organization and they have attached wholly who they are to one Myers-Briggs personality. I’m an ENTJ, or something, write on their name tag or on their cubicle, and they label themselves. Then it’s like that’s just the way I am and that’s how you need to treat me.
That’s one of my things. I love understanding the different personalities, whether defined under the DiSC, the Myers-Briggs, FIRO-B, all of them are really good if you take them into context and as a learning tool. Its taking all these different types of personalities to understand here’s everywhere that we move, and here’s where the other people are at that I’m talking to, or communicating with, where they could be.
Personally, I find all of the different types of personality assessments to be helpful depending on what it is you’re trying to do. But I also have to say that when I work with executives and many of my clients, I usually will not have them do it a personality test. However, I will almost always have them do the Strength Finder. So as far as assessments, I love Strength Finders.
So, Michael, what about have you find in your experience, any comments, suggestions on what you have found with giving personality tests?
Michael: I’m like you that if those personality tests had questions or answers where you can say it depends, I think that would make a lot of money first of all. But no, I think the Strength Finders is probably one of the more relevant ones. But, I was wondering if there are others or newer personality type indicator tests that are out there.
Meisha: Yeah, I’ve been exploring and I haven’t found them. What I have found though is if anybody out there is wanting to do a personality test and you don’t want to hire a professional to come in and do it or you don’t want to pay the money, there’s a website I would recommend. If you Google Carl Jung personality test, one of the very first ones that will come up is a great website https://www.123test.com/jung-personality-test/.
The first one that usually comes up is a website that has multiple personality tests for free that you can take. It has a version of Myers-Briggs based on. What’s really cool, if I remember correctly, they have the Carl Jung one that was one of the original. In the academic world, many people put more credence towards anything that was more off of Jung’s work than over some of the ones that have developed over the next couple of decades. So it’s a cool resource.
Let’s go to your second question about the introvert and the extrovert. Yeah, I deliberately don’t have those on this particular matrix. I do but I don’t. Let me explain that for a second, because you’re actually reminding me of something else.
I have this matrix that I use to explain the basic four: the Focuser, Innovator, Relator and the Operator. On that matrix, I have put all 16 of the Myers-Briggs personalities on there. It totally makes sense. If you really love your Myers-Briggs, and you want to see where you fall using your Myers-Briggs, you can look at that matrix. I’ll be happy to put that up on my website.
With that being said, with introverts and extroverts, what we are learning is that it’s more of a chemical thing. It is literally physically the way we are wired and how we then get energy and how when our energy gets depleted how we build that backup.
There’s some great research on introverts and extroverts and what we mean by those terms. For some people, when we’re in front of a lot of people, it can suck a lot of our energy, and then we need to be able to build that energy backup. You need to literally be away from that stimulus to allow that to build back up.
So that’s why it’s hard to talk about introvert and extrovert in these personality types, because it tends to become more physical and how that person is wired. So I have the disclaimer, that this grid does not truly take into account introverts or extraverts. The I and E I have on it is very generic.
Does that help, Michael? Any other quick comments from you before I wrap up?
Michael: Yeah, just one last question. Regarding who you think are some of the best CEO’s or better CEO’s out there. Where would you say your most favourite leader or CEO fall in the diagram?
Meisha: That is a great one because here’s its hard to nail them into one. Now, what is interesting with that though, is in the past, they tended to be the Focusers. We, as a culture, tended to really promote those people. They seem to get things done. They’re so task-oriented and business was all business, right? Time and place for everything. However, that’s changing and I think we are seeing a lot more of the Relators coming up.
In fact, it was interesting I just had this conversation about this. If you look at most large organizations they will have up at the top ranks, a balance. So for example, Howard Schultz is more of a Focuser. He is more of a data task-oriented person and then you had right underneath him for 20 years was Howard Behar and he was the heart. He was totally the Relator. The heart, you know, “it’s not about the coffee, it’s about the people”. And they balanced each other beautifully.
I personally see this a lot with the organizations that I work with – they have that balance of both. Somebody who is a Focuser (left side) and/or somebody who is a Relator (right side). I hope that helped.
Thank you Michael, so much for helping out and for calling in.
And again, everybody, thank you so much.
This show is all about personal and professional leadership development. You have been listening to the Meisha Rouser show and I am Meisha coaching you to success. Thank you so much for listening.